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Ma si che tra un po' uniamo i due thread... 
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Gentili visitatori e utenti,
Vi informiamo che il nostro indirizzo email è cambiato: ora potete contattarci a info@tlcworld.it
Siamo sempre aperti a critiche costruttive e suggerimenti, quindi non esitate a farci sapere le vostre opinioni. Promettiamo che non mordiamo!
Grazie per il vostro supporto!
lucafox ha detto:
Ma scusate, avete mai visto un investitore che ringrazia cordialmente i clienti, prima di vendere, con uno spot istituzionale?
E se poi si trattasse davvero di una campagna che da inizio all'ingresso del nuovo proprietario (che per ora non c'è) allora è davvero un'iniziativa diabolica.
E' solo una campagna istituzionale decisa da Wind che non è in alcun modo legata all'eventuale vendita a "dasvidaniacom". ^_^
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Credo che ormai di aggiornamenti ne vedremo lunedì, visto che oggi è sabato
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O i Russi o Sawiris basta che nè il marchio nè le tariffe (Vedi Omnitel/vodafone) vengano distrutte.Invece spero in un aumento d'investimenti nella rete
Comunque sia speriamo bene x il nostro amato gestore arancione
Comunque sia speriamo bene x il nostro amato gestore arancioneUtente
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Aspettiamo domani, o dopo domani, per avere news :S
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Dai creiamo una nostra società per acquisire il 100% di Wind
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Si sa qualcosa di più?
Fedelissimi
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Giony ha detto:
Se mai dovessero comprare, non comprerebbero mai anche il debito, cosa già detta e ridetta.. quindi sarebbe molto interessante vedere come.. andrebbe la gestione pura e cruda senza i debiti.. a chi li mollano? al cedente? ai lavoratori? alla società? boh?
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Fino ad oggi non si sa ancora nient'altro... non è che i russi ci hanno rinunciato?
Wind: Vimpelcom, no comment su possibile acquisto
ROMA (MF-DJ)--Alfa Group, azionista di VimpelCom, non ha voluto rilasciare commenti sulle voci di un possibile interesse per Orascom Telecom o Wind.
Evgeny Dumalkin, portavoce di Altimo, holding di Alfa Group, non ha commentato le indiscrezioni, ma ha ribadito la volonta' del gruppo di utilizzare VimpelCom come base per una espansione internazionale. La scorsa settimana Il Sole 24 Ore aveva riportato la notizia di un accordo imminente tra il miliardario egiziano Naguib Sawiris per la cessione di una quota di maggioranza in Weather Investments, che controlla Wind, a VimpelCom. red/liv
ROMA (MF-DJ)--Alfa Group, azionista di VimpelCom, non ha voluto rilasciare commenti sulle voci di un possibile interesse per Orascom Telecom o Wind.
Evgeny Dumalkin, portavoce di Altimo, holding di Alfa Group, non ha commentato le indiscrezioni, ma ha ribadito la volonta' del gruppo di utilizzare VimpelCom come base per una espansione internazionale. La scorsa settimana Il Sole 24 Ore aveva riportato la notizia di un accordo imminente tra il miliardario egiziano Naguib Sawiris per la cessione di una quota di maggioranza in Weather Investments, che controlla Wind, a VimpelCom. red/liv
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keyfaiv ha detto:
Questa non l'ho mica capita.... quando è arrivato Sawiris i debiti chi li ha comprati....? a me sembra li abbia presi lui, facendo altri debiti, ma ammetto di non capire niente di finanza speculativa...
Ora per come ho capito questa mossa, Sawiris venderebbe metà Orascom e tutta Wind e verrebbe pagato in azioni Vimpelcom (più del 20%), quindi di fatto si terrebbe una gran bella fetta del contenitore che conterrà anche Wind... non so a chi può smerciare il debito, potrebe anche essere che se li tenga Weather Investment (cioè se li tiene lui), ma di contro Vimpelcom si ingrandisce di brutto con una azienda che sta generando utili, ed aumenta il suo valore, quindi potrebbe pure tenerseli...
Alla faccia... vimpelcom sta avendo grossi problemi finanziari dopo la notizia di una possibile acquisizione...
In pratica stanno perdendo barconi di soldi nella quotazione del titolo...
Investors do not approve the transaction Of vimpelCom on the purchase of the active memberships Of weather Of investments. In the incomplete two weeks from that day, as it became known about the prepared purchase, company lost in the capitalization more than $3,5 billion, this approximately half of the sum of transaction. The quotations of the papers Of vimpelCom continue to be reduced on the New York exchange - investors does not satisfy the spontaneity of transaction, an increase in the debt load of company and the future change of its status.
In the course of yesterday's tradings on the New York Stock Market the quotations of depository receipts on the action (ADR) Of vimpelCom descended to 3,2%, to $14,1 - minimum value since May 25. From the onset of information about the negotiations with the Egyptian multi-millionaire By [nagibom] By [savirisom] about the acquisition of his telecommunication active memberships (see “"” dated August 12) company lost in the capitalization only more than $3,5 billion, or 16%. This is equivalent to half of that sum, which, according to the estimations, must be spent on the new acquisitions ($6,4-6,5 billion). For the last time is so swiftly it lost in the weight in May of this year against the background of the aggravation of the debt problems of Greece, when all stock markets fell. At the same time current drop in the quotations occurred against the background insignificant reduction in the market. The index of highly technological companies NASDAQ Of composite lost within this period only 3,7%.
According to the sources “"”, VimpelCom conducts the negotiations about acquisition by 100% of the third according to the value of the honeycomb operator of Italy Wind Of telecomunicazioni Of spA and 51% Of orascom Of telecom Of holding, that manages honeycomb operators in Asia and Africa. It is assumed that the active memberships will be paid both by the money and by their own actions Of vimpelCom Of ltd. Mr. [Saviris] with the partners can obtain about 20-23% of voting actions Of vimpelCom Of ltd. There is no as yet official confirmation of the prepared transaction. Information about the negotiations with the reference to its own sources last week published the Italian newspaper Il Of sole of 24Ore. Yesterday transaction with the reference to the sources confirmed the agency Of bloomberg. In VimpelCom Of ltd do not comment on the negotiations with the family Of [saviris]. Sources “"”, close ones to the shareholders Of vimpelCom, indicate that the agreement about the intentions can be signed not earlier than the end of September, which is connected with the complexity of the prepared transaction.
Investors extremely negatively relate to the possibility of the purchase of the active memberships Of weather Of investments. “Orascom Of telecom could be interesting purchase, if ex-nova owners it was possible to regulate situation with one of the basic “daughters” of company - with honeycomb operator in Algeria (local government prepares to nationalize this active membership. - “"”, says representative of one of the American hedge funds. - But it is not completely clear, why VimpelCom is necessary Wind - player on the saturated European market and furthermore burdened by enormous debt”. The manager of another hedge fund indicated that active expansion, including for the European market, promised to investors the head Of vimpelCom Alexander [Izosimov] to road of show before the completion of [oferty] on the exchange of the papers of joint stock company “[Vympelkom]” to the papers Of vimpelCom Of ltd. “But no one expected that the purchases can occur so soon, even to the forming command the headquarters (, until now, it is not assigned financial director VimpelCom. - “"”, before the presentation of strategy of the recently created company, and that purchases will be such large”, notes the representative of hedge fund.
According to the leader for analytical administration [FK] of Constantine Chernishev's “[Uralsib]”, the reaction of investors remains negative in connection with the doubtful prospects for an increase in the profitableness of the acquired active memberships and in this case with a sharp increase in the debt load of [emitenta]. Today profitability on EBITDA Of vimpelCom is of about 46%. Each block company generates approximately $160-200 million clean flow of money, and clean debt minus free means composes approximately $4,8 billion [Marzha] EBITDA Of wind Of telecomunicazioni Of spA and Orascom Of telecom Of holding (OTH) to 4-10 percent points lower than in Vimpelcom. At the same time joint debt load composes approximately $17 billion “difficult to name positive that the fact that as a result consolidation will occur reduction in the profitability Of vimpelcom and an increase in its debt load almost four times”, emphasized expert.
Mr. [Saviris] no longer the first time does not attempt to combine his telecommunication active memberships with another honeycomb operator. Previously Egyptian businessman conducted negotiations with south African MTN Of group; however, for sides could not be agree. At the beginning of June, when MTN Of group declared, what ceases the negotiations about the purchase of African active memberships OTH, its action they took off to 10% - this is the index of that how investors they relate to similar transactions, notes one of the collocutors “"”.
At the same time experts doubt, that a drop in securities Of vimpelcom was so essential only during the negative estimation of its financial indices. As a result this transaction Of vimpelcom it will leave beyond the framework of the CIS, first of all experts evaluate negatively into Italy, but consequences of the expansion of presence. “Now bulk of the minority shareholders of company - these are the funds for the actions of the developing countries, notes analyst “[VTB] of capital” Victor [Klimovich]. - After the transaction Of vimpelcom it will cease to relate also to the developing markets (Italy it will occupy 25% of EBITDA), which will destroy the declaration of funds”. According to its estimations, in the briefcases of such funds are concentrated about 20% of the total volume of the papers, dealt on the exchange. As expert notes, now these investors are inclined in favor securities MTS. On the sums of the tradings ADR MTS on NYSE within the period examined their quotations were reduced in all by 0,4%.
In pratica stanno perdendo barconi di soldi nella quotazione del titolo...
Investors do not approve the transaction Of vimpelCom on the purchase of the active memberships Of weather Of investments. In the incomplete two weeks from that day, as it became known about the prepared purchase, company lost in the capitalization more than $3,5 billion, this approximately half of the sum of transaction. The quotations of the papers Of vimpelCom continue to be reduced on the New York exchange - investors does not satisfy the spontaneity of transaction, an increase in the debt load of company and the future change of its status.
In the course of yesterday's tradings on the New York Stock Market the quotations of depository receipts on the action (ADR) Of vimpelCom descended to 3,2%, to $14,1 - minimum value since May 25. From the onset of information about the negotiations with the Egyptian multi-millionaire By [nagibom] By [savirisom] about the acquisition of his telecommunication active memberships (see “"” dated August 12) company lost in the capitalization only more than $3,5 billion, or 16%. This is equivalent to half of that sum, which, according to the estimations, must be spent on the new acquisitions ($6,4-6,5 billion). For the last time is so swiftly it lost in the weight in May of this year against the background of the aggravation of the debt problems of Greece, when all stock markets fell. At the same time current drop in the quotations occurred against the background insignificant reduction in the market. The index of highly technological companies NASDAQ Of composite lost within this period only 3,7%.
According to the sources “"”, VimpelCom conducts the negotiations about acquisition by 100% of the third according to the value of the honeycomb operator of Italy Wind Of telecomunicazioni Of spA and 51% Of orascom Of telecom Of holding, that manages honeycomb operators in Asia and Africa. It is assumed that the active memberships will be paid both by the money and by their own actions Of vimpelCom Of ltd. Mr. [Saviris] with the partners can obtain about 20-23% of voting actions Of vimpelCom Of ltd. There is no as yet official confirmation of the prepared transaction. Information about the negotiations with the reference to its own sources last week published the Italian newspaper Il Of sole of 24Ore. Yesterday transaction with the reference to the sources confirmed the agency Of bloomberg. In VimpelCom Of ltd do not comment on the negotiations with the family Of [saviris]. Sources “"”, close ones to the shareholders Of vimpelCom, indicate that the agreement about the intentions can be signed not earlier than the end of September, which is connected with the complexity of the prepared transaction.
Investors extremely negatively relate to the possibility of the purchase of the active memberships Of weather Of investments. “Orascom Of telecom could be interesting purchase, if ex-nova owners it was possible to regulate situation with one of the basic “daughters” of company - with honeycomb operator in Algeria (local government prepares to nationalize this active membership. - “"”
, says representative of one of the American hedge funds. - But it is not completely clear, why VimpelCom is necessary Wind - player on the saturated European market and furthermore burdened by enormous debt”. The manager of another hedge fund indicated that active expansion, including for the European market, promised to investors the head Of vimpelCom Alexander [Izosimov] to road of show before the completion of [oferty] on the exchange of the papers of joint stock company “[Vympelkom]” to the papers Of vimpelCom Of ltd. “But no one expected that the purchases can occur so soon, even to the forming command the headquarters (, until now, it is not assigned financial director VimpelCom. - “"”, before the presentation of strategy of the recently created company, and that purchases will be such large”, notes the representative of hedge fund. According to the leader for analytical administration [FK] of Constantine Chernishev's “[Uralsib]”, the reaction of investors remains negative in connection with the doubtful prospects for an increase in the profitableness of the acquired active memberships and in this case with a sharp increase in the debt load of [emitenta]. Today profitability on EBITDA Of vimpelCom is of about 46%. Each block company generates approximately $160-200 million clean flow of money, and clean debt minus free means composes approximately $4,8 billion [Marzha] EBITDA Of wind Of telecomunicazioni Of spA and Orascom Of telecom Of holding (OTH) to 4-10 percent points lower than in Vimpelcom. At the same time joint debt load composes approximately $17 billion “difficult to name positive that the fact that as a result consolidation will occur reduction in the profitability Of vimpelcom and an increase in its debt load almost four times”, emphasized expert.
Mr. [Saviris] no longer the first time does not attempt to combine his telecommunication active memberships with another honeycomb operator. Previously Egyptian businessman conducted negotiations with south African MTN Of group; however, for sides could not be agree. At the beginning of June, when MTN Of group declared, what ceases the negotiations about the purchase of African active memberships OTH, its action they took off to 10% - this is the index of that how investors they relate to similar transactions, notes one of the collocutors “"”.
At the same time experts doubt, that a drop in securities Of vimpelcom was so essential only during the negative estimation of its financial indices. As a result this transaction Of vimpelcom it will leave beyond the framework of the CIS, first of all experts evaluate negatively into Italy, but consequences of the expansion of presence. “Now bulk of the minority shareholders of company - these are the funds for the actions of the developing countries, notes analyst “[VTB] of capital” Victor [Klimovich]. - After the transaction Of vimpelcom it will cease to relate also to the developing markets (Italy it will occupy 25% of EBITDA), which will destroy the declaration of funds”. According to its estimations, in the briefcases of such funds are concentrated about 20% of the total volume of the papers, dealt on the exchange. As expert notes, now these investors are inclined in favor securities MTS. On the sums of the tradings ADR MTS on NYSE within the period examined their quotations were reduced in all by 0,4%.
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Sai che se i mercati bocciano l'operazione, potrei anche convincermi che è un'OTTIMA operazione per tutti?
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no, io volevo dire che semmai venissero i russi o gli americani o i cinesi, non verrebbero esclusivamente per il bene di cosa comprano (in questo caso di wind) ma per i loro interessi che vedrebbero in quello che comprano una opportunità di averli/crearseli.keyfaiv ha detto:
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E... perché?Winston Smith ha detto:Sai che se i mercati bocciano l'operazione, potrei anche convincermi che è un'OTTIMA operazione per tutti?
